Colossians
1:12 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated [us] into the kingdom of his dear Son:
1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, [even] the forgiveness of sins:
1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all [things] he might have the preeminence.
1:19 For it pleased [the Father] that in him should all fulness dwell;
1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, [I say], whether [they be] things in earth, or things in heaven.
From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> "firstborn from the dead"
>>QU> Can anyone tell me what Paul meant when he said that Jesus was the "firstborn from the dead" at Colossians 1:18?
FIRST OF ALL, verse 18 is part of a [statement] that BEGINS way back in verse 9, which begins with the phrase "for this cause", and the next sentence in verses 19 through verse 29 begins with the word "for", as also the next chapter. Paul, the master builder, is plainly building one course upon another. [The entire section is all inter-connected. :]
Now then, the sentence in question is not speaking about Jesus, by name, but in the context of "the Father" and "his dear Son". Jesus is God's "firstborn" (one word, not two), and God raised his "firstborn from the dead". It doesn't say he was "born" from the dead, but that he is the firstborn, in the sense that "he is before all things" (v.17) and "the firstborn of every creature".(v.15)
>CQ> I assume that your question stems from the fact that Jesus raised others before he was raised? The difference is that those Jesus raised were raised in to their old bodies and would die again.
Oh, really? Nowhere in the Bible does it ever say that anyone that was raised from the dead ever died again. Why do people assume such? ("God is not the God of the dead, but of the living!" --Jesus :)
>CQ> Jesus was ressurected in a changed body and ascended to heaven never having to re-experience death.
Right. He died "once for all", and was raised for our justification through faith in his blood. He ascended to the Father before sunrise of the first day, "when it was yet dark", when he wouldn't let Mary touch him. After sunrise, he let the women hold him by the feet; which indicates that he ascended above the universe to the third heaven, and returned. (Faster-than-light travel IS possible!) After the 40 days with the apostles, it doesn't say he ascended, but that he was "carried" (Lk.24:51p) or "taken up" (Ac.1:9p) into heaven.
>CQ> Lazarus and the others were akin to someone who wakes from a deep coma, whereas Jesus was raised as we will be when he returns.
Coma? Well, death is like sleep, but Lazarus' body was not comatose, but decomposing for four days, as his sister said, "By this time he stinketh." In Paul's explanation of how the dead are raised, he likens the corrupting body to seed: "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:" (1Cor.15:42) So, when Lazarus came forth, he didn't stink anymore.
What a sight when Lazarus came hopping/stumbling out, unable to see, since he was bound hand, foot and face in grave clothes!
"And he that was dead came forth, bound hand and foot with graveclothes: and his face was bound about with a napkin. Jesus saith unto them, Loose him, and let him go." (John 11:44)
Grace be with your heart, for Jesus' sake. Amen. --Richard
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From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> Subject: 'firstborn from the dead'
>>>CQ> So, then Jesus was the first to be resurrected to life in the heavens as an immortal spirit, correct?
>>QU> Correct.
Not exactly. Paradise is in heaven (singular). And Jesus is not a body-less spirit: "Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have." (Lk.24:39)
>CQ> No one who died before Jesus was raised, went to heaven when they died?
Three days BEFORE Jesus arose from the dead, he told the malefactor: "Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." (Luke 23:43p) According to Paul, "the third heaven" is "paradise"; therefore the malefactor was in fact in heaven that very day. Jesus died first, before the soldiers brake the legs of the others to hasten their death, so they would die before sunset! The new testament went into effect when Jesus died, therefore the malefactor who died later the same day, died under the new testament! (Saved by the grace of God! :)
>CQ> Is this correct?
Moses died and went to glory. Elijah didn't die, but went to glory. Enoch went to glory without dying. Paul was stoned, and left for dead outside Lystra and was "caught up into the third heaven." And of course, after he "rose up" and went right back into Lystra, there is no mention in the Bible of him ever dying again. Whereas Peter spoke of his own "decease" in his final epistle; Paul in his final epistle spoke only of his "departure" (release) and although he had finished his course, plainly his ministry was not finished, or else how could Mark be "profitable" to him "in the ministry."?
(To depart and to be with Christ is far better than corrupting in the grave! and far better than any thing in this present life. :)
Grace be with your heart in love, for Jesus' sake. Amen. --Richard
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From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> Subject: "Firstborn"
>>>CQ> So, then Jesus was the first to be resurrected to life in the heavens as an immortal spirit, correct?
>>RC> Not exactly. Paradise is in heaven (singular).
>CQ> The only Paradise that was familiar to Jews was the one that Adam and Eve lost. (on the earth)
Was? The only "paradise" in the Bible is in the "third heaven".
"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." (Rev.2:7)
"In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations." (Rev.22:2)
HER! Twelve manner of female fruit. The male Ezekiel 47:12 tree brings forth "new fruit according to his months..." HIS!
The tree of life is in New Jerusalem, the bride, the Lamb's wife, the paradise of God, that will descend "out of heaven from God."
"A garden inclosed is my sister, my spouse; a spring shut up, a fountain sealed. Thy plants are an orchard of pomegranates, with pleasant fruits; camphire, with spikenard, Spikenard and saffron; calamus and cinnamon, with all trees of frankincense; myrrh and aloes, with all the chief spices: A fountain of gardens, a well of living waters, and streams from Lebanon." (SOS 4:12-15)
AFTER the Lord scattered the people from Babel upon the face of "Pangæa", (Greek for "all the earth" --Gen.11:8p,) in the days of 13th generation Nimrod; he "divided" (Heb.palag=cleaved) the earth in the days of 15th generation Peleg, (whose name means EARTHQUAKE:) and he spread the continents we now see, around the planet into the world's largest jigsaw puzzle, and he left behind a MEASURING REED: "the longest straight ridge in the world", known as the "Ninety East Ridge" in the Indian Ocean, south of the "world's tallest mountain peak above sea-level", named after a surveyor who pronounced his name Eve-Rest, (the Tibetan's "mother of the world" mountain;) and the LENGTH of that Ninety East Ridge just "happens" to be the SAME as "the length and the breadth and the height" of NEW JERUSALEM!
"Twelve thousand furlongs" is a 1500 mile high city! "But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all." (Gal.4:26)
"And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God." (Rev.21:10)
(New Jerusalem is HUGE, but not too big to hide inside the MOON! :)
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From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> Subject: "Firstborn"
>>RC> And Jesus is not a body-less spirit: "Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have." (Lk.24:39)
>CQ> Explain to me how Jesus got through locked doors. John 20:19,26.
It doesn't say the doors were "locked", only that they were SHUT. An "earthy" (1Cor.15:48p) body cannot pass through an earthy door, but a heavenly body of non-terrestrial substance obviously can. Of course when we are "changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye" and have glorious bodies like unto the Lord's glorious body, NO doubt we'll understand these things better. (So, how does one FLOW, through a closed door, and not go below, into the floor? [Mt.14:30] :)
>CQ> And why his closest friends did not recognize him. John 20:14; Luke 24:15,16.
John 20:1p indicates "it was yet dark" when Mary found the sepulchre empty, and her eyes were full of tears from weeping. Note that when Jesus said her name: "She turned herself..." recognizing him. In Luke 24:16 their eyes were HOLDEN. Jesus hid himself from them in plain sight! Of course he had that ability before he died and rose from the dead for our justification through faith in his blood:
"Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by." (Jn.8:59)
(He could have walked into the apostles' house with them and been hidden in the room before they "shut" the doors for fear! :)
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From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> Subject: "Firstborn"
>>>CQ> No one who died before Jesus was raised, went to heaven when they died?
>>RC> Three days BEFORE Jesus arose from the dead, he told the malefactor: "Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise." (Luke 23:43p) According to Paul, "the third heaven" is "paradise"; therefore the malefactor was in fact in heaven that very day. Jesus died first, before the soldiers brake the legs of the others to hasten their death, so they would die before sunset! The new testament went into effect when Jesus died, therefore the malefactor who died later the same day, died under the new testament! (Saved by the grace of God! :)
>CQ> But even Jesus did not go to heaven that same day. He was not raised from the dead until the *third* day. (and ascended to heaven many days later)
Remember that Jesus is The Lord and receive the love of the truth. Eternity is timeless, as he says, Before Abraham was, I AM! Before the malefactor was in paradise that day, the Lord is in heaven!
Jesus saith, "If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven." (Jn.3:12,13)
As for your idea that he didn't ascend until "many days later", we have before proven, that when the Lord Jesus would "not" let Mary touch him, because he had not yet ascended, he then did in fact "ascend" (as he said in Jn.20:17p) and returned, and "met" (Mt.28:9p) certain women who "held him by the feet, and worshipped him."
Around 40 days later, at the mount of Olives, it doesn't say that he ascended, but that "he was parted from them, and carried up into heaven" in Luke 24:51p, and again, "while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight." (Acts 1:9p)
(Note the same word "parted" in Lk.24:51p which you also saw in the translation of Elijah in 2Kings 2:11, where Elijah was taken up. :)
And again [the] "two witnesses" that stood by them in white apparel: "Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven." (Acts.1:11p) He was carried up and will be carried back. He left in a cloud, and will return with the clouds of heaven.
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From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> Subject: "Firstborn"
>>RC> The new testament went into effect when Jesus died, therefore the malefactor who died later the same day, died under the new testament! (Saved by the grace of God! :)
>CQ> The malefactor had not been baptized, he had not been 'born again.' At John 3:3-5 Jesus said that "unless anyone is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."
Surely you're not that blind! Even eyes of flesh can see that the Lord himself interpreted Verse 5 in the very next verse (6). You were "born of water" (v.5) when you were "born of the flesh" (v.6). You can dunk your corruptible flesh in water until you are red, white, and blue in the face and still be just as lost as Judas Iscariot! Being born "of the Spirit" (v.5), being "born of the Spirit" (v.6) is being "born again." (v.7) "born again... by the word of God" (1Pet.1:23p).
"The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and wither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit." (Jn.3:8)
Being born again by the word of God is not something men can see! (The sound of being born again is not water-gurgle or baby-babble:)
The word of faith says, That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved; For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved! The malefactor that died after the new testament went into effect with Jesus' death, was saved by the grace of God under the new testament.
WHAT MUST I DO TO BE SAVED? - "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved, and thy house." (Acts 16:31p)
>>RC> Moses died and went to glory. Elijah didn't die, but went to glory. Enoch went to glory without dying.
>CQ> Resurrections to heaven don't happen until Christ' second 'coming.' 1 Corinthians 15:20-23.
Only the "redemption of the body" awaits the advent. ALL the saints in Christ Jesus the Lord are UP HERE where we "sit" together in heavenly places, God having "raised us up together with Christ"! (Hast thou never read Ephesians 2:4-7? or John 11:23-26,44? :)
The gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus! Do you have eternal life? or not! Do you believe the Lord Jesus Christ? or not!
"And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God." (1Jn.5:11-13)
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From a message by a Curious Questioner--
>CQ> Subject: "Firstborn"
>>RC> Enoch went to glory without dying.
>CQ> Hebrews 11:5 talks about Enoch. Hebrews 11:13 says that 'these all died' (including Enoch)
The words "including Enoch" do not appear in verse 5 [about] Enoch, nor in verse 13. IF you are going to wrest the scriptures to your own destruction you may as well go whole-hog and claim that "these all" of verse 13 includes the "elders" of verse 2 and the "we" of verse 3, (and the first "he" of verse 6, which ought to be THEE! :) Heb.11:6-- "But without faith [it is] impossible to please [him]: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and [that] he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him."
"These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth. For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country." (Heb.11:13,14)
The PROMISES were given to "Abraham" (v.8), "Isaac" (v.9), "Jacob" (v.9), and "Sara" (v.11). THESE were "strangers and pilgrims" in the land of PROMISE! These all died in faith, seeing the promises afar off! These all were buried in the "cave" you may behold at Hebron--
The entrance of the cave is covered with a building you enter first. Inside the first large chamber, two tents over the graves of Isaac on the right, and to the left, that of Rebekah (whose family blessed her to be "the mother of thousands of millions".) Going into the next passage, behind wire-mesh doors, the grave of Abraham on the left and Sarah on the right. Further in past an open walk are the chambers where Jacob and Leah were buried. (Rachel was buried north of Bethlehem, "in the border of Benjamin at Zelzah" [1Sam.10:2p] and Joseph's wife Asenath was reportedly buried there also.)
The prophecy that Enoch "should not see death" already came to PASS! He has already been TRANSLATED! Changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye! ("And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" --the Lord Jesus :)
Remember that Jesus is the Lord and receive the love of the truth. The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ be with us all. Amen. --Richard
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